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Old 03-15-2009
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Lightbulb Why affermations are useless BS

That's what I've suspected all along, and it turns out your conscious mind, the part that repeats affirmations and positive thinking and all that neato-sounding Tony Robbins kinda stuff, does NOT make your decisions for you.

It's science.

Ask the Wall Street Journal, baby. You make decisions BEFORE you are consciously aware of them, so by the time you tell yourself, "self, you are a bad-ass motherfucker," your brain/body has already made a decision on whether or not that is true... and your words will never change it.

Check it out:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1214...s_inside_today

Fishing in the stream of consciousness, researchers now can detect our intentions and predict our choices before we are aware of them ourselves. The brain, they have found, appears to make up its mind 10 seconds before we become conscious of a decision -- an eternity at the speed of thought.

Their findings challenge conventional notions of choice.
[Image] Corbis

"We think our decisions are conscious," said neuroscientist John-Dylan Haynes at the Bernstein Center for Computational Neuroscience in Berlin, who is pioneering this research. "But these data show that consciousness is just the tip of the iceberg. This doesn't rule out free will, but it does make it implausible."

Through a series of intriguing experiments, scientists in Germany, Norway and the U.S. have analyzed the distinctive cerebral activity that foreshadows our choices. They have tracked telltale waves of change through the cells that orchestrate our memory, language, reason and self-awareness.

In ways we are only beginning to understand, the synapses and neurons in the human nervous system work in concert to perceive the world around them, to learn from their perceptions, to remember important experiences, to plan ahead, and to decide and act on incomplete information. In a rudimentary way, they predetermine our choices.
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How do you best make up your mind? Are you better off when you sleep on a decision? What does this mean for our sense of choice and free will? Share your opinion in an online forum.

To probe what happens in the brain during the moments before people sense they've reached a decision, Dr. Haynes and his colleagues devised a deceptively simple experiment, reported in April in Nature Neuroscience. They monitored the swift neural currents coursing through the brains of student volunteers as they decided, at their own pace and at random, whether to push a button with their left or right hands.

In all, they tested seven men and seven women from 21 to 30 years old. They recorded neural changes associated with thoughts using a functional magnetic resonance imaging machine and analyzed the results with an experimental pattern-recognition computer program.

While inside the brain scanner, the students watched random letters stream across a screen. Whenever they felt the urge, they pressed a button with their right hand or a button with their left hand. Then they marked down the letter that had been on the screen in the instant they had decided to press the button.

Studying the brain behavior leading up to the moment of conscious decision, the researchers identified signals that let them know when the students had decided to move 10 seconds or so before the students knew it themselves. About 70% of the time, the researchers could also predict which button the students would push.
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Is your freedom of choice an illusion?

Your brain knows what you're going to do 10 seconds before you are aware of it, neuroscientist John-Dylan Haynes and his colleagues reported recently in Nature Neuroscience.

Last year In the journal Current Biology, the scientists reported they could use brain wave patterns to identify your intentions before you revealed them.

Their work builds on a landmark 1983 paper in the journal Brain by the late Benjamin Libet and his colleagues at the University of California in San Francisco, who found out that the brain initiates free choices about a third of a second before we are aware of them.

Together, these findings support the importance of the unconscious in shaping decisions. Psychologist Ap Dijksterhuis and his co-workers at the University of Amsterdam reported in the journal Science that it is not always best to deliberate too much before making a choice.

Nobel laureate Francis Crick -- co-discoverer of the structure of DNA -- tackled the implications of such cognitive science in his 1993 book The Astonishing Hypothesis: The Scientific Search for the Soul.

With co-author Giulio Tononi, Nobel laureate Gerald Edleman explores his biology-based theory of consciousness in A Universe Of Consciousness: How Matter Becomes Imagination.

"It's quite eerie," said Dr. Haynes.

Other researchers have pursued the act of decision deeper into the subcurrents of the brain.

In experiments with laboratory animals reported this spring, Caltech neuroscientist Richard Anderson and his colleagues explored how the effort to plan a movement forces cells throughout the brain to work together, organizing a choice below the threshold of awareness. Tuning in on the electrical dialogue between working neurons, they pinpointed the cells of what they called a "free choice" brain circuit that in milliseconds synchronized scattered synapses to settle on a course of action.

"It suggests we are looking at this actual decision being made," Dr. Anderson said. "It is pretty fast."

And when those networks momentarily malfunction, people do make mistakes. Working independently, psychologist Tom Eichele at Norway's University of Bergen monitored brain activity in people performing routine tasks and discovered neural static -- waves of disruptive signals -- preceded an error by up to 30 seconds. "Thirty seconds is a long time," Dr. Eichele said.

Such experiments suggest that our best reasons for some choices we make are understood only by our cells. The findings lend credence to researchers who argue that many important decisions may be best made by going with our gut -- not by thinking about them too much.

Dutch researchers led by psychologist Ap Dijksterhuis at the University of Amsterdam recently found that people struggling to make relatively complicated consumer choices -- which car to buy, apartment to rent or vacation to take -- appeared to make sounder decisions when they were distracted and unable to focus consciously on the problem.

Moreover, the more factors to be considered in a decision, the more likely the unconscious brain handled it all better, they reported in the peer-reviewed journal Science in 2006. "The idea that conscious deliberation before making a decision is always good is simply one of those illusions consciousness creates for us," Dr. Dijksterhuis said.

Does this make our self-awareness just a second thought?

All this work to deconstruct the mental machinery of choice may be the best evidence of conscious free will. By measuring the brain's physical processes, the mind seeks to know itself through its reflection in the mirror of science.

"We are trying to understand who we are," said Antonio Damasio, director of the Brain and Creativity Institute at the University of Southern California, "by studying the organ that allows you to understand who you are."
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Old 03-15-2009
Nick Krygier Nick Krygier is offline
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So just because your subconscious reality is giving off a negative vibe, does that mean that you have to make your conscious one's the same? You have to start somewhere
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Old 03-16-2009
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Can you explain your question Nick I can seem to grasp what your trying to say... WTF your question looks simple, I must be high or some shit.
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And for FUCK SAKE...STOP...SAYING...SOCCER" Peter
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Old 03-16-2009
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just a note: I am a 16 year old broski. I am by no means an expert psychological analyst. the following is just the way I've come to view shit. if it's wrong, then kindly point out my faults.

what Nick is speaking of is a concept in NLP. mefinks what he means is that we all have, or can create the inner resources we need to achieve our goals. you are more likely to succeed if you act as if this were true, than if you act the opposite. your outer representation is a reflection of your inner world. that's why inner game is so damn important in "pooah". this relationship is a two-way road. so if you act "as if", then you will subconciously replicate your inner shit to be in congruence with your behaviors. you gotta start off somewhere, as nick put. nah mean?

so, say a homie's got no confidence. I, being the nice nigga that I am, tell him that he would profit from acting as if he's got confidence, because he has to start off somewhere. right? so my nigga will keep his head up and walk with an ill swagger, and act like he's on top of the world, as it were. confidence derives from experince. ergo, as my nigga lives through many events, he learns more, and gets more confident in himself. his inner subconcious becomes harmonious with his concious reality. all's good with my nigga, all's good with me, and we all have a gay old time.

the above example IS true. I've done the scenario with a couple of friends, and watched them blossom into pimped out motherfuckers. I've also used this approach when I had a bad period in my tumultuous futbol career, haha. it's part of the mindset that I've had for a while now: live life; grow confident with new experiences.
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Old 03-16-2009
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Though there are quite a few situations where lying to yourself like this causes major problems. Here's an example my social psychology teacher told us about:

Soldiers are over in Iraq for quite a long period of time. For the most part, they have decent moral while they're overseas, because they expect everything to be great when they get back home to America.

What causes problems is when they get back and things aren't great. We're in the middle of a recession, and there aren't very many jobs to go around. Financial problems can lead to family problems. Being gone for that length of time could cause a number of other problems to come up.

The discrepancy between expectations and reality causes people to become depressed. It could be any problem that causes a gap between what someone expects and what reality actually is.

So I think people need to be careful about how they use affirmations. I don't think there is any harm in convincing yourself that you super confident. However, I don't think you should tell yourself stuff like,"I'm going to succeed" or "All these bitches want me." Because if you fail, your mood will fall much further than if you were realistic with yourself.

When I go out to do something, I always tell myself that I'm going to do my best, and if I fail, it wasn't a waste; it was practice.
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Old 03-16-2009
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What dmacfour is exactly what happend to me. I used affirmations but my mind knew that I was already lying to myself, what ended up happening is I got fucked even more. Maybe affermations could work when one needs just a bit of motivation, but should not be used to fully change your whole state of mind since you will be cheating yourself.

I also wrote an article about telling your self that you X when you are actually Y.
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Old 03-16-2009
Nick Krygier Nick Krygier is offline
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I'm not talking about lying to oneself. I'm talking about affirmations.

Fake example:

Inner Dialougue: "You're shit, you'll never live up to your potential you might as well just stop right now. blah blah your a horrible person. blah blah:
Me to self: "You're a great person."
Inner Dialogue: blha blah blah blah your so bad
Me to self: "That's cool, you can think that" I wish the best to ya though

Affirmations is just another one of those words that are so broadly understood by people that it's dangerous saying that they are BS to people. I've written an response about this before that was chastised but it's all good. I'm not holding any grudges hehe. I view affirmations differently then tona, and dmca views them different from both of us, even if just slightly. We must agree on a proper definition of a word before we ever start giving an opinion on something because when we don't know where the other person is coming from then might not understand. We are probably all right from our own perspectives and experiences. But from a person who has not made an opinion on the matter they might get an unhealthy opinion on the matter when they really have no experience. That's no bueno.

BTW, i love your responses granny. they are always spot on and clearing up what's going on in my head. and funny.
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Old 03-18-2009
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haha, thanks nicky ma homeboi.

and yeah assuming a role of confidence is by no means a negative thing. it is necessary to have self-belief. if a nigga takes a no affirmation outlook, then how will he begin any journey? he will have doubts on whether or not hhe'll have a successful outcome, and since he can't commend himself, he will resolve to not start the said journey; he will never improve as a man.
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Old 03-19-2009
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This is pretty interesting.
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Old 03-19-2009
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I just read action's thread here. It (number 4) basically proves what I've said throughout this post, so ... w00t for a nigga. yeh boi.
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Old 03-19-2009
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I can actually attest to this or to something like this, at the risk of sounding insane.
Sometimes late at night when I'm sitting in bed, I'll have some thought go through my head, and it echoes. It just echoes like I'm thinking it and then thinking it again and again and again and again. Often I feel like it's a subconscious thought, and then it's a conscious thought, and then sometimes to rile myself up, I'll even go as far as saying my thoughts.

Of course, this mental torture is even worse when I realize that it's happening (I realize it pretty quickly every time), and then I can't stop.
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